ComicsPriceGuide.com Forums - Marvel Comics - Marvel VS DC! - Messages https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 ComicsPriceGuide.com Forums - Marvel Comics - Marvel VS DC! - Messages en-us http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Jitbit AspNetForum Sat, 27 Mar 2021 19:20:28 GMT Sat, 27 Mar 2021 19:20:28 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Defiant1 rgtichy wrote:
StrafeFireRun wrote:
The problem with DC is how overpowered they represent their heroes. That is the reason that their villains are so great, they have to try and figure out how to beat impossible odds. This was bad enough with Superman being the answer to everything and it's getting worse as Flash is becoming more powerful with his Infinite Mass Punch. DCs villains have to be better to pose any kind of threat.



Another factor for Marvel superiority is in its Editing. Compare the number of necessary ret-cons that DC had to go through to correct continuity to Marvel. Most of Marvel's come from a desire to tell a different story. DC had to make corrections or discount history.




Yup. The flaws at DC were built in back in the very beginning, though. There was not a concept of all of them even existing together in the same "universe," originally. Like you say, having a Superman makes everyone else a waste of time. AND, they are unable to fix it. Even in the recent movie Justice League, my sons walked out of the theater with me (after hearing me talk of this problem with Superman for years) and my 18 year old kid says "So, they were getting their butts kicked until a Kryptonian showed up!"

But, guess who my favorite is.


Superman.






That said, the first Wonder Woman was a great superhero film.


Hey Ox.I typically don't read your posts. I don't rate anything you write as being worth the effort.
I've dropped back to just spot-checking the posts here about every 2 or 3 months.

You are welcome to respond to this post, but most likely I won't even know you did.


df1]]> Sat, 27 Mar 2021 19:20:28 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Theoldcollector Konungrcomics wrote:
I miss news print paper, the smell when I open one of these books takes me back to my childhood. Oh and I'm more marvel then DC, I think what sold me growing up was the selection.


I wish they would bring back news print. Today's comics always feel and look a bit awkward to me. I still read and collect them but I would much rather it go back to the ways of the old lol.]]> Fri, 26 Mar 2021 23:06:34 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Konungrcomics Fri, 26 Mar 2021 13:39:09 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Oxbladder fdaz89 wrote:
Defiant1, I agree with you 100% (about your assessment of the comics industry, not about you being a negative person). Having corporations like Disney own so much of it doesn't help. One thing I noticed is that all the ads are missing in comics, reading the ads added to the appeal of comics for me in my youth. Ad revenue would (or should) lower the price of comics, but so would going back to newsprint. Making superstars out of people who couldn't tell a story (like Rob Liefeld), I think negatively affected the hobby. I think the speculation market doesn't help, either. All the things that provide a barrier to new people from picking up the collecting bug should be examined and eliminated where possible.


Newsprint is more expensive. It would only make books lighter not cheaper.

Making super-stars out of talent isn't a problem BUT it did increase costs dramatically because now, instead of paying everyone a pittance out of a pool creators have contracts and are paid a hell of a lot more than they were back in the day. That model was never going to be sustainable and it has dramatically changed the industry. \

Now the other thing is that companies don't make someone popular. They publish their stories, sure, but readers/collectors decide who is and who isn't super-stars.

There are super-stars for writing there are super-stars for art but there are few that can do both. Very few. Jack Kirby great artist, not so good a writer. Stan Lee, good for ideas and writing but was always better when he had an equally good artist and idea man along side him. Stand alone Stan and and Jack stuff are lackluster team them up and you had something special. John Byrne a good artist from the 70's to the 90's but don't give him the writing duties because his writing sucks and now his art is nothing special. Rob Liefeld, the guy should never write or draw, however, some of his ideas and creations are not bad. Todd McFarlane, decent artist but his writing leaves a lot to be desired, he would be better to co-write than do it alone. So no super-stars don't hurt but it can hurt if we make them believe that they are so great that they can do no wrong. Always second doubt any star that say only he or she knows how to present a character. Chances are far better that they are going to bomb out than bring revolution.]]> Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:41:32 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Oxbladder Defiant1 wrote:
fdaz89 wrote:
Defiant1, I agree with you 100% (about your assessment of the comics industry, not about you being a negative person). Having corporations like Disney own so much of it doesn't help. One thing I noticed is that all the ads are missing in comics, reading the ads added to the appeal of comics for me in my youth. Ad revenue would (or should) lower the price of comics, but so would going back to newsprint. Making superstars out of people who couldn't tell a story (like Rob Liefeld), I think negatively affected the hobby. I think the speculation market doesn't help, either. All the things that provide a barrier to new people from picking up the collecting bug should be examined and eliminated where possible.


In the 90's a lot of the comics switched to higher quality paper because the advertisers wanted their ads to look good and the cheap paper wouldn't reproduce the colors and details they wanted to use.

Advertisers quit buying ads in comics. There wasn't enough bang for the buck. I agree they should at least try to sell ads. Speculation helps the publishers immensely because it allows them to print more. If they can print more, the cost to print each comic comes down. Most of what you are paying for when you buy a comic is the production costs and setup costs for printing.

If you print a million copies of something, the cost per unit is pocket change. If you print 100 of something, it costs paper money.


Think of it like this.

If I pay an artist $100 to produce one page of art and make 5 photocopies. I'd have to sell the 5 copies for about $20.02 each to break even on production costs. I haven't even paid myself a dime. That's just to break even on what i paid the artist and what I paid for the paper.

If I print 10,000 photocopies of that art I only need to sell them all for 3 cents each to break even. The catch is, i have to sell all 10,000.


As volume increases, the publisher makes more profit on each comic sold.


That's why they produce all the variant covers. If they can sell a significantly larger number of interior pages just by swapping out a cover, it helps them break even on production costs faster.

The problem is, it runs off "collectors" over time because they can't keep up. They don't get a sense of satisfaction by owning 5 versions of the same comic. It dissuades customer loyalty.

Defiant1


As someone who has been around the hobby for a while and having seen it from on both sides of the counter I would disagree with many of your points.

The switch from newsprint to glossy stock may have begun with some special issues and advertisers but the ultimate permanent switch came, without doubt, from the fact that glossy stock became far cheaper to use than newsprint. Advertising has been pretty much eliminated for the reasons you say, there isn't much bang for the buck.

Costs of printing are simply not the only reason modern book are $3.99 and more. You could have as cheap a stock as possible, which they do, and larger runs but that is no guarantee that costs will go down. In the late 80's and first 4 years of the 90's some print numbers were huge compared to now but that didn't stop the increases from coming. Why is that? Well, costs for printing, shipping, distributing, and most important the paying of the creative talent didn't and doesn't get any cheaper. How talent is paid now is completely different and is the single largest cost that companies pay and if you want to have the most regarded talent in your pool you have to have the big dollars to pay for it. So the model of printing more isn't going to mean falling prices.

Yes variants help the companies and they keep pushing them out because it works to their advantage and the market's advantage because everyone makes money off of them. But at this point I would say that there is going to have to a be a revolutionary change in the industry in order to get the print numbers up to a point where a price drop is not only possible but sustainable. Those numbers would have to be maintained for a long time and all of the costs that go into producing comics will have to not increase. Since that isn't going to happen, people have to be paid after all and they certainly won't be happy to see shareholders take all the profit.

Now with content of modern books. Personally, I like a lot of the offerings from many of the companies. I don't judge a book by how long it takes to get through it or the volume of the text. That was a change that many people of my age were not okay with. Couple that with price increases and it can be hard thing to take because we always want more and if buying new costs more then we can't buy more. That being said collectors have always complained about the most recent 20 years of books for a multitude of reasons that have not changed for decades. What it boils down to is that they simply grow out of things. It doesn't hold the same magic it once did and they get angry. They get angry about the changes because ultimately we don't like change. If it's isn't broke don't fix it right? Well the only thing you can do is make incremental changes or, as is the case with both DC and Marvel, try not to rock the boat and, instead bring back ideas that succeeded in the past or serve up "easy money" by catering to the current trends that are selling, like variants.

Now Marvel DC have the unenviable position of being the long time leaders in comics and their histories go back decades and their characters have become staples to many people who love them for a variety of reasons. When they screw with them they have come expect that it can blow back in their faces or spell the next chapter of success. More often than not thought you have people complain because they have this revisionist history that tells them that back when they were young those were the best comics. No crap came out. Well that simply isn't true. since I started collecting a large majority of collectors have always complained about new books. I started in the 1979 and most of the books from mid 60's to 1979 was fodder with the few excepts, the keys. Even a large bulk of the 30's, 40's, 50's books were cheap(er) because they were not in vogue, not key issues, or simply not worth spending a lot on because they were not super-hero books.

Now I think it is always sad to see people get out of collecting but it happens. Sometime the things we use to like change so much that we lose interest. It's sad but it happens. I just wish that some of those people wouldn't condemn the whole industry (sometimes constantly) for that change. There are a wealth of book that they can go back to and revisit. Who knows, maybe one day a change will come that you do like and bring you back into the fold. I think a lot of damage comes when people who have stopped collecting or stopped with new books keep crapping on them. IMHO it just keeps retcons and rehashes and rebirths the order of the day. Nostalgia has been both the greatest driver and inhibitor to this hobby.]]> Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:24:24 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from rgtichy StrafeFireRun wrote:
The problem with DC is how overpowered they represent their heroes. That is the reason that their villains are so great, they have to try and figure out how to beat impossible odds. This was bad enough with Superman being the answer to everything and it's getting worse as Flash is becoming more powerful with his Infinite Mass Punch. DCs villains have to be better to pose any kind of threat.



Another factor for Marvel superiority is in its Editing. Compare the number of necessary ret-cons that DC had to go through to correct continuity to Marvel. Most of Marvel's come from a desire to tell a different story. DC had to make corrections or discount history.




Yup. The flaws at DC were built in back in the very beginning, though. There was not a concept of all of them even existing together in the same "universe," originally. Like you say, having a Superman makes everyone else a waste of time. AND, they are unable to fix it. Even in the recent movie Justice League, my sons walked out of the theater with me (after hearing me talk of this problem with Superman for years) and my 18 year old kid says "So, they were getting their butts kicked until a Kryptonian showed up!"

But, guess who my favorite is.


Superman.





That said, the first Wonder Woman was a great superhero film.]]> Wed, 10 Mar 2021 23:18:54 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from StrafeFireRun


Another factor for Marvel superiority is in its Editing. Compare the number of necessary ret-cons that DC had to go through to correct continuity to Marvel. Most of Marvel's come from a desire to tell a different story. DC had to make corrections or discount history.]]> Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:58:27 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Defiant1 fdaz89 wrote:
Defiant1, I agree with you 100% (about your assessment of the comics industry, not about you being a negative person). Having corporations like Disney own so much of it doesn't help. One thing I noticed is that all the ads are missing in comics, reading the ads added to the appeal of comics for me in my youth. Ad revenue would (or should) lower the price of comics, but so would going back to newsprint. Making superstars out of people who couldn't tell a story (like Rob Liefeld), I think negatively affected the hobby. I think the speculation market doesn't help, either. All the things that provide a barrier to new people from picking up the collecting bug should be examined and eliminated where possible.


In the 90's a lot of the comics switched to higher quality paper because the advertisers wanted their ads to look good and the cheap paper wouldn't reproduce the colors and details they wanted to use.

Advertisers quit buying ads in comics. There wasn't enough bang for the buck. I agree they should at least try to sell ads. Speculation helps the publishers immensely because it allows them to print more. If they can print more, the cost to print each comic comes down. Most of what you are paying for when you buy a comic is the production costs and setup costs for printing.

If you print a million copies of something, the cost per unit is pocket change. If you print 100 of something, it costs paper money.


Think of it like this.

If I pay an artist $100 to produce one page of art and make 5 photocopies. I'd have to sell the 5 copies for about $20.02 each to break even on production costs. I haven't even paid myself a dime. That's just to break even on what i paid the artist and what I paid for the paper.

If I print 10,000 photocopies of that art I only need to sell them all for 3 cents each to break even. The catch is, i have to sell all 10,000.


As volume increases, the publisher makes more profit on each comic sold.


That's why they produce all the variant covers. If they can sell a significantly larger number of interior pages just by swapping out a cover, it helps them break even on production costs faster.

The problem is, it runs off "collectors" over time because they can't keep up. They don't get a sense of satisfaction by owning 5 versions of the same comic. It dissuades customer loyalty.

Defiant1]]> Thu, 10 Dec 2020 20:15:10 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from fdaz89 Thu, 10 Dec 2020 05:35:28 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Defiant1 fdaz89 wrote:
Defiant1, while I agree with many of your points, I do not agree 100% with your conclusion that all modern comics suck. While much of it can be considered drivel, there are many high quality books still being put out. I started collected near the start of the Bronze age, with one of my first purchases being Star Wars No.1. I was big into Marvel, mainly Spider-Man, but they were all great back then; Hulk, Avengers, Nova, Ms. Marvel, FF, Jim Starlin's Captain Marvel and Warlock runs and so on. It's a different landscape these days and I'm fine with that. While I still enjoy Spider-Man, the non-superhero stuff companies like Image, Aftershock, Dynamite, etc. are publishing are much more fulfilling. They may not be great investments, but I'm reading what I enjoy, which is what its supposed to be about.


Here lies the primary difference. I have skimmed over modern comics and I find none of it to be entertaining. I could list hundreds of shortcomings by breaking down inadequacies at every stage of the process.

I'm honestly glad people enjoy the product. It would be a lot of wasted time and effort if someone didn't.

I do arrogantly believe that if I enjoyed the product, there would be a LARGE number of consumers who would also enjoy the comics. I believe comics would be selling better.

If comics were selling better, the cost to produce each unit would be cheaper and the publishers could drop the price to something more reasonable. Lower price point for their product would increase the odds that even more consumers would be willing to allocate their disposable income on buying the product.


I'm a quality inspector for a living. I inspect the parts that our suppliers deliver. I have a reputation for being picky and finding flaws that other don't see. Some of those flaws relate to safety. Lives can depend upon whether I find something wrong with a product. The chances that I'm going to find a flaw, an inadequacy, a shortcoming, and NOT say something is almost zero. I even point out my own flaws and tell people they aren't acceptable. What people fail to see is that by observing the flaws or shortcomings of a product, it also reveals opportunities to improve the product and make it better for everyone... to make it more popular... and as a byproduct make it more affordable.


I have a reputation online for being negative, but that's because I see the potential for greatness being wasted and mired in a quicksand of mediocrity. A mediocrity that is killing the industry. One of the longest surviving comic shops in my areas closed very recently. The pandemic killed it. If their cash flow was better... if their back issue selection was better... if their product was better, I believe they could have survived a few months of lost sales. That is not the perspective of a negative person. People online can believe what they want to believe, but anyone who knows me in person has the complete opposite opinion.]]> Wed, 09 Dec 2020 23:02:53 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from fdaz89 Wed, 09 Dec 2020 18:24:14 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from glorkar I dropped out of the hobby for a couple of decades.
Now I'm back in and I'm really enjoying DC, Batman and Detective Comics especially.
Don't get me wrong, I've got a couple of Marvel titles that I'm following as well (Black Widow and Strange Academy). But looking at the X-Men books now, there's just something about the art and layout that doesn't appeal to me.

Ugh. If I had to pick one, right now, today, I'd have to go with DC for comics.]]> Thu, 03 Dec 2020 18:31:55 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from stephanm
At first glance (and probably second), Marvel.
Just looking at my collection, almost 6000 Marvels, and a little over 2000 DCs ... seems obvious ...

And my first and ongoing love are Silver Age Marvels. Although I wasn't around to read them when they were new, the Marvels being published in my native Germany in the 1970s were mostly reprints of the 60s books.
Nothing will ever beat my youthful excitement over the Galactus saga, or the Vision's first appearance, or Pharao Rama-Tut, who became Kang, or the young X-Men in the Danger Room, or those Spider-Man issues by Ditko then Romita (although I read them the other way round, because when I started collecting, there were the Romita issues, and only afterwards I got the back issues). A bit later, actually in a fanzine, I first saw Buscema's Conan (OK, Bronze Age now...) from the Savage Sword mags (and later Barry Smith, in a way-too-small paperback edition, but wonderful nonetheless).

But in later decades it becomes less clear cut. I think the 70s still belong to Marvel, with the aforementioned Conans, and the "cosmic" books, usually by Jim Starlin etc.

But DC was really catching up, not least through Neal Adam's stunning Batman books, and other masterpieces (OK, he started in the Silver Age, but I'd count him as the master of the early Bronze Age). The Englehart/Marshall Rogers Detective Comics run was also a highlight.

Early 80s clearly belong to Marvel, with John Byrne towering over everything (chiefly his X-Men run of course, but pretty much everything else, too), Miller's Daredevil run, Simonson's Thor.

But then things changed. First Byrne and Miller switched to DC. Of the big events, I liked Crisis much more than Secret Wars (probably because of George Perez)

And then, crucially, the British writers at DC/Vertigo created, to my mind, the best (kind of...) superhero comics of all time. As I read them in my late teens, early twenties, they might not have created the childlike excitement of the Silver Age Marvels, but the quality of writing was beyond anything seen before.
Moore's Swamp Thing run! Then, of course, Watchmen, towering over everything before or since. Gaiman's astounding Sandman. To a lesser degree, Morrison's Doom Patrol. I think Marvel had nothing remotely comparable (the Macfarlane Spider-Man run, some decent Epic stuff etc., but not the regular high quality of the Karen Berger era at DC/Vertigo).
So second half 80s and early 90s, I'd give to DC.

Afterwards I stopped reading regularly, but from what I have read (usually digitally -- since comics paper became more glossy, I feel like I might just as well read them on my iPad. I loved the pulpy paper of old...), the two publishers have become pretty indistinguishable in quality (which is generally very high, arguably higher than in my favorite eras, but lacking that sense of wonder...)]]> Thu, 03 Dec 2020 12:17:31 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Spektor19 Thu, 23 Apr 2020 17:58:23 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from WaveWarrior
DC = Comics, Animated Movies, Video Games, Movie Soundtracks, Themed Songs/Melodies, and TV shows

Marvel = Comics and Movies

____________________
Marciano Weber
CPG ID: WaveWarrior
Display Case: https://comicspriceguide.com/members/wavewarrior
____________________
edited by wavewarrior on 9/25/2020]]> Tue, 10 Mar 2020 14:18:31 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from rustyauger Tue, 10 Mar 2020 09:29:25 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from quinnspuddinjoker Thu, 05 Mar 2020 13:01:00 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from tarn kronos Sat, 22 Feb 2020 13:46:58 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Defiant1 rixmaxx wrote:
Defiant1 wrote:
I only care about Marvel characters, but all modern comics suck. For that reason, I'm not picking a favorite.



Way to live up to your name! rock on




I've quit collecting comics. So, yes. You are probably correct.

I've stood on my soapbox and described precisely what I don't like about modern comics and

what types of expectations I have as a consumer. I've challenged people in the industry to make a product that appeals to me.

Creators nod and understand, but they go back and make the exact same comics I detest.


It's not like I woke up one day and decided I didn't like modern comics.

The industry changed and the knowledge of the ages on how to make comics fun, engaging, thought provoking, and interesting is being lost.


I was attending local comic shows and the back issues I want to collect were appearing less and less. The condition of the stuff they did have was in lower grade than ever. The prices are higher than ever.

Finally a dealer confessed that he can't restock on the types of stuff I ask for. He says the market has dried up on supply and he just can't get the stuff anymore.


For that reason, I quit collecting entirely.


I have probably comics 10,000 including Amazing Fantasy #15, FF #1, Hulk #1, X-Men #1 (2 copies), Strange Tales #110 (3 copies), Hulk #181 (2 copies).

I'm not getting rid of anything people want because I don't need the money and I still like the comics.

I could sell off the junk I don't care about, but it isn't worth my time. I can make all the overtime I want at work and selling comics doesn't earn me money at the same hourly overtime rate.


Modern comics are essentially a money pit unless you spend hours monitoring price fluctuations and capitalize on a steady flow of quick flips. I still make more money at my regular job.


For the sake of reading, I have thousands of old comics I have never read. I bought them in bulk for about a dime a piece when stores were closing left and right in the 90's. I get more enjoyment reading a 10 cent comic with more story content than a $4 or $6 modern comic.


I attempted to stay connected to the hobby by researching old comics and making online cover galleries. Published historians know about my discoveries and we've shared info in the past. I just scanned a piece of original art I own and donated some of my research information to an upcoming fanzine. I've asked the publisher to not give me credit, but they will likely do so anyway.


I've decided to quit all that also. The web is changing and free web hosts have been randomly deleting my sites because I don't convert to their pay model and let them up-sell me to something I don't need. I'm donating content to their site, so I feel that gives their domain relevance where it had none. I'm not going to pay for hosting. I was already giving away my time on the research.


I guess the real question is... why am I here? Because my comics still have value and this site is a price guide. It's no different than buying stock and checking the newspaper periodically to see how it's doing.


Take care...

Defiant1]]> Sun, 09 Feb 2020 20:57:03 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from rixmaxx Defiant1 wrote:
I only care about Marvel characters, but all modern comics suck. For that reason, I'm not picking a favorite.


Way to live up to your name! rock on]]> Sun, 09 Feb 2020 11:40:34 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Defiant1 Sun, 09 Feb 2020 10:24:37 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Imcubillo
- Now dead but Vertigo always produced great mature content that did not fall into the superhero realm
- DC Black Label produces some awesome stories and the format of the books is great and very high quality in my opinion
- DC is doing it the right way, when we have a 80-100 page book, lets get a square bound spine - I hate that Marvel still uses a regular spine on these giant books and keeping a nice copy together is a pain in the butt

I also think that historically DC has had much better self contained graphic novel stories than marvel as i can think of so many iconic graphic novels from DC and not as many from Marvel = Watchmen, Dark Knight, Killing Joke, Red Son....]]> Fri, 07 Feb 2020 07:49:22 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Gilgandra Fri, 07 Feb 2020 00:03:38 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from solarno
Now with the movies, give me Marvel over DC. All. Day. Long.

Go figure.]]> Thu, 06 Feb 2020 23:07:12 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from BasementComics Thu, 06 Feb 2020 15:22:17 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from hearse101011

People that are heroes will be infinitely more entertaining to me than Heroes who pretend not to be.


Superman pretends to be Clark Kent
Batman pretends to be Bruce Wayne
Wonder Woman tries to be Diana


Peter Parker tries his best to do good.
Steve Rogers must uphold his moral code no matter what.
Tony Stark is selfish.


The last three are much easier to find parts of yourself in. (I know I am very guilty of over simplifying)
edited by hearse101011 on 2/6/2020]]> Thu, 06 Feb 2020 14:31:48 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from ladybug5753iey Sat, 16 Feb 2019 13:48:17 GMT https://www.comicspriceguide.com/forum/messages.aspx?TopicID=12958 Message from Minimilk Mon, 21 Jan 2019 13:06:59 GMT